Book Club Series: Bob DePasquale on the Secrets to Utilizing Tech for Good and Being Radically Generous

Hello friends. I am absolutely delighted - and I use that word intentionally today - DELIGHTED for you to meet my next podcast guest. Bob DePasquale, also known as “The Generosity Guy” reached out to me many moons ago when he was crafting together this book that we are going to talk about today. At the time, he knew way more about me than I knew about him, which was super intimidating…but as you’re about to find out when you listen to him, it only took about fifteen seconds for me to feel like we’d been friends our entire lives. 

He has such a cool positive energy about him, and so when he and I met for the first time in Atlanta this past November and he shared his personal story of facing cancer and 9/11 as a freshman athlete in a school thousands of miles away from home…I was once again reminded that breaking points don’t always have to break people. 

His story is one of encouragement and hope, and the impact of a specific part of his story is the reason behind his way of living what he’ll refer to as “radical generosity.”

Go for a walk, or grab a cup of tea and find a place to settle into for the next 45 mins with me and Bob. Here’s my promise that you won’t regret it.

Where to find Bob:
On Twitter: @BDePa
On IG: @BDePa
On LinkedIn: Bob DePasquale
On Amazon: Personal Finance in a Public World

Check out the YouTube video of this episode here!

For full disclosure statement, visit www.alphaarchitect.com/disclosures/

Transcript

[00:02:47] Jess: Bob, thanks so much for being here on the show with us today. I, as I was talking about before we hit record, there's so much that I want to ask you. There's so many interesting things about you and your story about the way that you approach finance.

 One of the things that I appreciate the most about you is just this ease, this genuine conversation. A spirit that you have about you. So wherever this conversation goes is gonna be great. And I definitely want to get the story behind the book today, but before we dive into all of that just take us back just pull the curtain back on Bob as a kid, as a person. Give us the backstory. Walk us into the story that we're in now, but back us up a few years. 

[00:03:41] Bob: Jess, appreciate you having me on the show. I'll absolutely do that. 

[00:03:44] Jess: Yeah. 

[00:03:44] Bob: Thank you for using the word interesting. I will pull the curtain back cuz I think when I was a kid they might have described me as menacing or something other than interesting. But hopefully as I've matured or grown up a little bit here in the past decade or so I've become interesting. But my life. 

[00:04:01] Jess: You do have Dennis The Menace hair going on. 

[00:04:04] Bob: Yeah. There you go. That's what I'm going for. 

[00:04:06] Jess: Okay. Alright 

[00:04:07] Bob: Little something different.

My, my life started in New York. I was born in Long Island and I only spent the first few years of my life there. And my parents chased my grandparents down to South Florida when they retired and moved down here. And I've lived here other than college ever since, and I pretty much consider myself a Floridian.

 I loved it because it was sunny all year long. You could play sports outside all day. And I've always appreciated being outside and being able to just walk outside in a pair of shorts. And so I suppose that's why I still live down here and I'm thankful to my wife for being willing to move down to South Florida.

I actually, I played sports in college and I had a chance to keep playing, but I decided to hang up the cleats so I can go home and study broadcasting and get warm. And I did that university in Miami. 

[00:04:52] Jess: The weather. That's hilarious. 

[00:04:53] Bob: Yeah it's all about the weather. Some people say they, they stopped playing sports because they weren't good enough or because they got hurt, or some other reason I did, because I was too cold. Says something for my toughness.

But I ended up coming back to South Florida, went to the University of Miami for grad school, and I worked in graduated with my master's in broadcast journalism. Worked in sports radio for a couple years, and long long story short, I got recruited into the financial industry and that was about 13 years ago.

[00:05:20] Jess: Recruited into finance, what does that mean? 

[00:05:23] Bob: I got a phone call from a guy one day and he said, Hey, I just left your wife's school and I really want to talk to you about working for our company. And the, as the story goes, he walked into the office at the school my wife teaches at, and the, there was three ladies, and said, ladies, you know anyone who might wanna work in finance?

And they're looking at this guy like, okay, you don't have a kid here. You don't go, you don't, you have no relation to this school. Why are you walking in asking for financial people, not the right place. And he said, come on, you gotta have a name or somebody. So they actually gave him my wife's name and they said Mrs. DePasquale's husband is a nice guy, so why don't you call her. So I ended up talking to him and I put him off and I, to this day Jess, I don't know why I said it, but I said I'll call you back in six months. I think it was just to get 'em off the phone. 

[00:06:13] Jess: Yeah. 

[00:06:14] Bob: And six months went by and I was working some weird hours in, in working in sports radio. And there were some questionable things going on at the radio conglomerate I worked for. And I don't know, I just, something clicked in my mind. I said, you know what, my, my parents raised me to be a man of my word. I told this guy I would call him back. Six months have gone by. I'm gonna call him back.

So I called him and he ended up wining and dining me a little bit and convincing me that it would be a good move and I could really affect people's lives positively. And I made the leap. And that was, like I said, about 13 plus years ago now. And here I am 

[00:06:47] Jess: yeah. Yeah. Oh, cool. That, thanks for sharing my my ears perked up because My story connects so much with that. How did you feel about that industry change at, can you, it's 13 years ago, but can you remember? 

[00:07:03] Bob: Yeah, I, so the two things stick out in my mind.

One is I came from an entertainment style medium where we were just trying to make people call into the show and laugh. And to be honest with you, argue about sports. And then I moved to a much more, I dunno, professional slash serious life-changing type of work. So that was interesting.

[00:07:27] Jess: Yeah. 

[00:07:27] Bob: But one of the, one of the other things that I realized is that my, in my financial career things felt so much more collaborative and that's really what I liked about it. In my radio career, it was like every show was competing against the other shows on the same network.

When I got into the financial industry, although it's very competitive that's why I mentioned it's challenging, at least the environment that I was put in at my previous firm was very collaborative. They encouraged us to work together and learn from each other. So that was pretty encouraging at the time.

[00:07:54] Jess: Fast forward now you're Bob DePasquale, the generosity guy, right? 

Is that something that was a character trait that was already weaved in and flowed through you into financial advice?

Or was that something that you got into financial advice and thought, cool, this resonates with me and then it's the place that I can make a difference here? 

[00:08:14] Bob: Yeah. Great question. At that point in my life when I made the career change I think I was somewhat interesting and not menacing enough to realize what I felt like was important in life and in the world. And, but what I didn't think was, or I didn't realize, is that you could express it professionally.

 What I realized is that you can combine the work that you do on a daily basis with positive impact in the world.

And so I felt like I could do that. Yes. And John, by the way, the guy who recruited me his name was John. And right after I got hired, And I started my career. He retired like the next day, . And this guy, I don't know if that means he went out on a high note or was finally sick of all the crazy people he was recruiting and he quit. But I felt that he did a great job of explaining how I could positively impact people's lives from it. So I, that at that point I realized I could express it professionally. 

And you mentioned about the generosity guy title. I love that brand. I love the concept of generosity, specifically radical generosity. It's just something that I really care about. And the reason why is that one of the most amazing, generous acts I, I've ever experienced happened when I was 18.

And I mentioned that I had gone up to New York for college. So remember when I was three, I moved down to Florida. I went back up to college in Long Island, New York, thinking, okay, I got three reasons why I'm going to college. One is to get an education. Now, this is not necessarily in this order, but I knew an education would come some one way or another.

Number two was I could play football, and number three was I could be a little bit closer to my cousins and my aunts and uncles who I never really got to spend time with because I moved out of New York when I was a kid. 

So I moved up in the summer before my freshman year of college and the campus is like empty, right? So it's basically an opportunity for you to get to know some people. Your teammates in training camp is challenging. And so within the first couple days Of training camp I thought I pulled... actually, to this day, I'm not even sure if I actually did, but I, we had what I thought was a pulled groin muscle.

Now, you work out Jess, you 

I've had a pulled groin 

[00:10:19] Jess: muscle. 

[00:10:20] Bob: You know what that feels like? I do. You can't stand up, you can't sit down, you can't twist, let alone run down the field football field or , do some power cleans or something in the gym. Like you can't barely move if you have a severely pulled groin muscle.

And that's how I felt. And it was extremely disappointing cuz I thought I was this invincible 18 year old, I was gonna go up to New York and conquer the world. 

And so I had this pulled groin muscle and it was pretty disappointing cause I'm trying to prove myself to my teammates and ultimately my coaches so I can get on the field. And I was in the training room on a daily basis up at 5:30-6:00 in the morning, and a college training room is packed full of like a hundred people on a training camp day in the morning.

And so it's, the commotion is unbelievable. And the rehab exercise that my doctors or my trainers were having me do was I would sit on a three-wheeled stool and I would shimmy across the training room, which was probably a hundred feet long. It's a massive room and I'm part of the exercise I would assume was just dodging the people to strengthen the muscles when your hip and your groin area.

So this is me. Everyone else is doing more normal things. And here's the little freshman doing these stupid stool exercises. And at one point the head trainer stands up on a box. Now he was a tiny guy, and in order to get everyone's attention, he would have to stand on a box and yell. And I'm pretty sure it got dead silent randomly, or at least it sounded that way. And he yelled and he cupped his hands and he and stood on top of the box and was like, Bobby, you gotta get back out on the field. You're acting like a weakling. And when the 5'8", 125lb soaking wet trainer calls you out in front of all your new teammates and coaches, it's a hit to your ego. 

[00:12:01] Jess: Yeah. 

[00:12:02] Bob: And so I, I said, oh, man, I am such a loser. His name was Rick. And to this day, I owe him, I, you'll find out I actually owe him my life. So no criticism anymore. But at the time I was like, Rick, you're killing me. Like you're calling me out in front of the team. How would you feel? I'm not getting any better. I wanna be out on, you know I wanna be out there playing.

And he said, all right if you're really not getting any better, then I'm gonna send you to a doctor. So over the next week, or a week and a half or so, I had a series of tests. And now I'm 18, so I'm technically an adult. I had a car. So I'm driving around Long Island by myself the next week and a half, going to all these doctor's appointments and Jess, I had ultrasound, sonogram, CT scan, MRI, you name it, every test in the book, I had. And these appointments would last forever and I'd have to fill out all this medical paperwork. I didn't know what copays and deductibles and what medicines I was allergic to. No clue. 

[00:12:55] Jess: Yeah. 

[00:12:55] Bob: Family history, all this other. And I'd be in there for an hour just filling out paperwork. Then I'd have to wait an hour, and then I'd have to have a test that would last an hour long.

So I would be in these offices for three plus hours. And finally the last test that I thought I was gonna have, I went into the doctor's office on the day that my parents were flying up for what would've been my first ever college football game. Now, we knew I wasn't playing in the game at this point, but my parents were still gonna come up.

Yeah. Because they hadn't seen me. And this was a Thursday, and so I went into the doc. I drove to a doctor's appointment and I expected to be there for three hours. They would probably leave me a message and then I would, meet them at my uncle's house, which was where, my, my mom's brother where we were all gonna meet.

And I went into the office, I was in there for maybe 30 seconds. They called my name. I, there was no paperwork, I didn't have to fill out anything. They took me back into the office, sat me down. And in less than two minutes, the doctor comes in, sits down at the desk and says, Bob, glad Bobby glad you came in.

Just wanna let you know you have cancer. And I said, what? My jaw opened and dropped and hit the desk. And I was like, how can you just tell me that? Like I'm not supposed to have, can you run another test or something? . And he is I know you're probably in shock, I'm gonna hook you up with an oncologist but you're free to go.

And I just walked out of there in shock and I didn't even know what an oncologist was at the time, but I walked out of the office building and I kid you not, just like divine timing. It's the moment I stepped out of the building, my cell phone rang and it was my mom and she was like, oh, hey, we just landed how'd the appointment go?

And I was like about that appointment, mom the doctor told me that I have cancer and Jess, I could just feel the air sucked outta the car that they were driving in. 

[00:14:42] Jess: I can't. 

[00:14:44] Bob: she said nothing but was like screaming all at the same time. It was like the most memorable couple seconds of my life.

And the only thing I could hear after a little bit was my dad yelling on the other end. He was like Susan, what's wrong? And my mom's name is Susan. And he knew something was wrong. He could feel it too. 

[00:14:59] Jess: Yeah. 

[00:15:00] Bob: And we all met back at my uncle's house where we were supposed to, and we stared, we looked at each other for a minute.

I hadn't seen my parents in months, the first time I had ever been away from home that long. And we gave each other, these big hugs and we shed some tears and we shed some prayers and we just sat around in shock the rest of the evening. And so Friday we ended up speaking with an oncologist and doing some more tests.

And Saturday comes along, which was the day that was supposed to be my first game. And we're all sitting at my uncle's house and his best friend comes over. And this guy comes into the house and says hi to my uncle and introduces himself to my parents and says, Bob and Susan hi, my name's Tim. These are my keys.

He pulls his keys out of his pocket hands his keys to my parents and says, I can't imagine what you're going through with your son right now, but I want you to have my car and you can use it for as long as you can possibly need to. So he gets treated and you figure out what to do. And needless to say, we, my parents were still in shock.

They didn't know what to say or how to even respond, I'm assuming we just said thank you. And within 15 minutes he was gone. He showed up basically just to give us the keys, said goodbye to my uncle and aunt and walked out. That's it. Never met the guy and was gone. So that was on Saturday. 

A couple days later was Monday morning, and my oncologist had given me advice.

At this point, I had already hooked up with him and he said I should stay enrolled in some classes. So I actually went to my first ever college class Monday morning. Got back in the car, Tim's car, and drove Tim's car to another appointment. And pretty uneventful first day of college. The second day though, I got up, went to my second ever college class, and when I came out I had some things to do and I wanted to stop and grab something to eat.

So I went to the cafeteria and I'm sitting there eating a breakfast burrito. Now, do you remember those tube type of small televisions that they would have like in a cafeteria or public place? 

[00:16:51] Jess: Yeah. 

[00:16:51] Bob: They, it's hanging from a bracket in the corner of the ceiling in the wall. 

[00:16:55] Jess: Yeah. Yeah. 

[00:16:56] Bob: And I'm in New York and I'm, I don't, don't know what TV channels to watch what the news is on.

So I'm sitting there eating my breakfast burrito, the news is on, and all of a sudden a plane hits one of the twin towers . And I'm thinking to myself, whoa. What a horrible accident. And so I called my dad, who's still at my uncle's, and I said, Hey dad, you watching this? He goes yeah, I got the news on and we're talking for, a minute or whatever.

And all of a sudden, bam, the second plane hits the other tower and he's oh, you better come home, son. Something's wrong. This was not an accident. . So to be honest with you, that breakfast burrito might still be sitting in the cafeteria. I jumped up, I hightailed it outta there, got in the car and I drove to my uncle's house.

Now, I mentioned earlier that I have a master's degree in broadcast journalism and I worked in AM Sports Radio. That trip was supposed to, would normally take me 15 minutes. It took me nine hours and I listened to all of the 9/11 terrorist attacks, coverage on AM radio with it, driving away from the city, looking at seeing the burning buildings in the distance.

And I pulled my car into my uncle's driveway, excuse me, into my uncle's neighborhood, and I ran out of gas. This was like the amazing timing of all this happening. And we actually had to push my car into his driveway. And we're, once again, we did the same thing we did a few days before that. We looked at each other what is going on now? Not only is my life threatened, now the whole world is being threatened, and we didn't know what to do. 

And so we walked inside and my aunt was hysterical. She was going nuts because my uncle was on business previously the night before, and we couldn't get ahold of him. . And he was supposed to fly home in the morning. He finally calls at, let's say it's maybe eight o'clock at night and he says, Hey guys, I'm stuck in Denver. I was supposed to fly home, but I'm really sorry. I've been trying to get through. I know you're probably nuts, but I'm okay. Everything's fine. And we were like, Relieved. Finally something good happen. But he goes, but guys, I hate to tell you this, but Tim, my, my buddy who you just met this past weekend, he was in the towers this morning and he died. 

And we were like, oh, you've gotta be kidding me. This guy did what a incredibly generous act he did for us. Didn't even know us. And he lost his life. 

And it just didn't feel right that he didn't deserve to lose his life, especially if he was an extra generous person.

And it told me a lesson at a very young age that we don't know how much time we have here. And we don't know how much stuff, whether that's money or resources or toys or technology, electronics, whatever it is, we don't know how much we're going to accumulate in our life. And we don't know how much time we have either, so why not share it with other people?

And so I learned the lesson of generosity at a very young age. Regardless of what you have, whether you work for an investment bank or you have a more modest career, we all have gifts, skills, talents, and resources to give to other people to make the world a better place. 

[00:19:45] Jess: Yeah. Oh, there's so much there, whether I'm putting myself in your shoes and just the chaos of that season. And what does it even take to keep putting one foot in front of the other to, can't even imagine going to school and then that being your second day at school. 

The thing that I want to say over the whole story here, is the incredible possibility of just continuing to trust and lean into the next step. So for Tim, there was a moment I imagine where he had a feeling, he had a thought, this is a family who needs something, I have a car that I can give. And the difference between him and someone else is that he trusted this idea of generosity and leaned into it and then just followed through. And there's parts of your story of just trusting that gut instinct and leaning into it and moving forward with it and trusting it to get you to another place that's better than where you are right now. And I think for me, that's what I keep seeing every time we talk and every time I hear this story from you. 

[00:21:20] Bob: I appreciate you helping us think a little bit more deeply about Tim's mindset. I have told this story numerous times. We're recording this in 2022, so that was 21 years ago.

It's hard to believe. , 

[00:21:32] Jess: yeah, 

[00:21:32] Bob: it time flies. And but I appreciate you, you putting us in Tim's shoes, if you will, because a, as many times as I told the story I don't know if we, I don't know if I've ever been asked that question or if it's ever been phrased that way. I will tell you, it's not hyperbole.

When I say every day, I think of that time of my life. and that's somewhat of a gratitude practice, and it's also somewhat of just a. A very vivid memory of those times. Like you said, it was a bizarre that 9/11 was a bizarre day. But so was 9/6 or whatever that was five days prior to that for me.

And so, so that period of time hits me all the time because without it, I wouldn't be first of all, without it, I wouldn't, I almost wasn't here because of it. And then, but at the same time, without it, I wouldn't be the person I am.

So it's got this really strange dichotomy of something that almost killed me, but something that gave me more life than anything else that ever happened to me. So it's really interesting. 

And so to put ourselves in the shoes of Tim, two things come to mind. I've had the pleasure of speaking with his kids. He had three that they were all very young at the time. And it's been really deep conversations, but we'll never actually know. And it, I could be completely missing. But the two mindsets, or the two things that come to mind when I think about Tim during that period of time, one was that was just his routine. It's just what he did. Like he was just a nice guy. Someone was in need, he was gonna help him out, and that's how he operated. And so maybe there was just a routine time of life for him, and nothing was different and it just felt normal. 

But then on the other side of me says and I know other people have experienced this in my studies and in the work that I've done to focus from a scientific perspective on generosity, I've also found that some people have certain moments or events in life that for whatever reason, something triggers, whether it's an opportunity or someone encourages them or who knows that, they see the light, who but something comes along and they suddenly have an opportunity to be radically generous.

And I would describe Tim's giving me a car as a form of radical generosity. Because if you think about it, most people in his situation would not do that. And anyone that he would've potentially asked Hey, how can I help Bob Bobby DePasquale? The answer probably for most people would not be why don't you just give him your car?

most people would probably suggest something else. Who knows? But I feel like it, it could easily be a combination of both of those, but in my mind it's it was either something that he just naturally did, cuz that was just him and he was known for being generous, or maybe it was an opportunity for him to really make a difference, to really have a direct connection with someone and a resource that he could provide for us.

I don't know. Yeah. But I do know I'm very, I'm not confident in that. I don't know. But what I am confident in is that Tim felt some joy and fulfillment and some kind of, natural desire to be helpful in that moment. 

[00:24:29] Jess: Yeah. Yeah. And that that whole experience for him, regardless of what prompted him to make that decision had such incredible impact in your life and in the lives of everyone who hears that story, right? It's not just it's just not a gift that he gave to you. It's a gift that he gave to everyone who has the opportunity to hear about his generosity.

In a very apropo moment this morning I went through Chick-fil-A, cuz my daughter has an appointment on Monday mornings, and so after the appointment we always go grab Chick-fil-A before I take her back to school.

And so we were in line this morning and I got up to the counter and I, my brain was full of a million things. And so I got up to the counter and the guy handed me my bag and he was like the person in front of you paid for your meal.

 I've done this before where that's happened and I've just said thank you, and then I've pulled off and then 10 seconds later I'm like, haha, such an idiot. Why didn't I keep doing this? Like, why didn't I pay for the person behind me?

And so there's this moment of like immediately. Oh okay, I got this. This time I'm not gonna forget. I wanna do this. I know I wanna do this. I know, especially a minute from now, I'll be glad that I did this. And so I was like, Hey, can I pay for the person behind me? And he was like, yeah, absolutely.

So I paid for the person behind me and drove off. And it's taken some time for me because I've gotten it wrong in the past. It wasn't even my initial reaction. It was still a little bit delayed, but it wasn't delayed enough that I missed the opportunity to be generous and to pass that generosity on.

And this whole idea, like you said about Tim, it was just his nature to be generous. And yet at the same time, this nature to be generous is still something that at some point along the way, either was cultivated for him or he intentionally cultivated. And as far as that relates back to finance and what you do now and kinda your career, cause I know that this is something that you work with businesses about. Do you see that people are able to cultivate generosity? And if they are, what's the pathway for that?

If I'm, For me, it was lots of failure, being in that drive through line, at least a few times where I'm driving away going, ah, crap. And then just being able to recognize it in the moment. But what is someone who wants to be more like Tim? Where do they start? What do they do? 

[00:27:19] Bob: So scientifically, and I'm not a psychologist, but I've done a little bit of research and it is proven that there is a sense of nurture in generosity. You can teach people to be more generous and you can give them tips and ways and suggestions on how to live it out in their lives.

And it's also scientifically proven that it feels good. There's a Ted Talk by a woman by the name of Wendy Steele. I talk about it all the time. She talks about oxytocin. If you're a mother, you know about this hormone being involved in birth, but it's also related to the bond that people have together.

And so acts of giving spur oxytocin in three parties. The giver, which most people know, have experienced what it's like to feel like they've given a gift to someone. It feels good. Yeah. The person who receives it, obviously we all like getting gifts, but also third parties, just an onlooker, will receive that hit of oxytocin and it feels good.

And so I bring that up because when I'm working with families or businesses that ask me a question like that, like how do I be more generous? Yeah. It's not necessarily a specific act. I could give you a laundry list of things that you can do or just kind and generous for people.

Simple little things like opening doors use, using kind words saying Please and thank you. Offering to help people when they're in need. Just helping people without asking sometimes is a powerful thing too. For example, we have a friend right now who's been in and outta the hospital and very sick.

I know that if we ask her husband, what can we do for you? How can we help you? Can we bring over dinner? Can I mow the lawn? He would say no. But if I just go over there and do it that kind, generous act is pretty meaningful. So I can give you all kinds of suggestions on ideas, on ways to implement it. Even in your business too, there's ways that you can be a generous entrepreneur. But I think what's most important is the mindset and tapping into it, and I truly believe maybe outside of some people that may have severe differing abilities or illnesses. I believe that every human being has a natural desire in some way or another to support others.

That doesn't mean it has to be financially or it has to be with a specific task. Whatever way your gifts and skills allow you to do that, I think everyone has a innate desire to do it. But what happens is we actually have learned behaviors that tell us otherwise. And so I do believe we can train people to be more generous, but we ultimately don't have to make someone generous.

Tim happened to be excellent at implementing it. He knew how it worked. He was confident that his generous acts would help other people. It made him feel good. it would be celebrated even though he didn't want the recognition. But he knew that it would be good for the community.

So it's not about teaching someone to be generous. It's about tapping their generous spirit that just naturally exists in them. From the beginning of time, humans have always had this desire and need. Honestly, we rely on each other. I know technology might tell us otherwise, and there's any number of courses out there and self-help books and all these different things that'll tell you that you need to be better and you need to do this and figure it out and power through.

And don't get me wrong, I was an athlete. I felt it when I was on the training table with my groin injury that I needed to push through and do it myself. And I can tell you a little bit more about the psychology I had when I was going through cancer treatment as well, but when it comes down to it, we all have different abilities that are there to help each other and we rely on each other to, to survive in this world.

And so just by that fact alone, I think individuals, families, and ultimately businesses, it would behoove them to concentrate on a generous spirit and mindset. And when I'm speaking with a company, I will absolutely unequivocally tell you that generosity is good business. It's good for your company.

[00:31:01] Jess: Yeah. And on that cuz you mentioned something about technology, how, I know your book. did you cover this idea of generosity and technology and whether technology has been helpful in facilitating the ability to be generous. For example, the thing that comes to mind is like Facebook, right? Every year on my birthday, if I raise a certain amount of money, then Facebook matches. And are those things helpful in cultivating a generous spirit or in improving the metrics of generosity? What's the net on tech? 

[00:31:43] Bob: So unpopular opinion. In a lot of cases, no. In some cases, yes. And here's why I say that. I think once again, going back to the generous spirit and mindset and I believe generosity is a mindset and not an event. And that's a key part of some of the talks that I'll do is that it's an all-encompassing feeling or state. Yeah. It's generosity is not, I gave a toy to a needy child during the holidays. That's a good thing and I would encourage you people to do that, but it's, why did I give the toy to the child and what other children and other people are gonna feel that, that oxytocin hit and ultimately do more of their own giving.

[00:32:19] Jess: Yeah. 

[00:32:20] Bob: And technology, what technology allows us to do is be more efficient. And you mentioned my book, every chapter of my book is dedicated to a different portion of our financial lives. And spoiler alert. I don't wanna ruin the book for anyone who wants to read it. But I ultimately Determined by the time I finish my research for the book that it's not just about the bottom line all the time and that makes you feel comfortable.

It's about your relationship with money and technology. And so every book, every chapter of the book is dedicated to another topic in financial planning and our personal finance. And one of them is absolutely generosity. Now we can be extremely financially generous, but not have a generous mindset, and that's why I say that technology in a lot of cases may not actually be helpful for cultivating the mindset.

What it's very helpful in is Facilitating transactions reminding you to make financial, charitable transactions executing them, maximizing tax deductions. Some of the charities and organizations who use online giving very well whether it's a just a nonprofit supporting a cause or a lot of faith institutions, whether it's a church or synagogue or temple, they use these systems very well too because they're enabling their members and congregants to consistently give without having to whip out their checkbook and remember to bring it on a Sunday morning or Friday night or figure out how to get it all done.

It just happens automatically. And so while those tools are good for efficiency they don't actually connect you to the cause. Absolutely. And there is a lot of data that suggest that people who just give automatically financially are less connected to an organization or a cause or a person in need than the people that actually get their, that, that put a little sweat equity in or actually meet and get involved with the causes that they're supporting.

And then the theory is that over time you'll end up giving more money because you're more deeply involved with the cause. So I don't know if that answers your question, but technology has a part in it, but it's not outside of maybe teaching some courses and maybe helping some people understand about the science behind generosity.

I don't think it's ultimately what's going to make us increase whatever the metrics are that are important. And it's not just the dollars, it's impact. It's like what's actually getting done with your dollars is more important than how much money you're giving. 

[00:34:38] Jess: Yeah, no, it absolutely answers my question. And I was curious before we got on the call just to see what helps facilitate and increase levels of generosity. And one of the big things I kept coming across was this idea of empathy and empathy being related to generosity and being related to cultivating generosity.

And, this is just my own perspective, being a mom of a 14 year old. But technology tends to, in our experience, really blunt that opportunity for empathy. And I notice that the more that she and I talk, the more we connect with each other, the more empathy, the more she feels like I understand her.

Which is a common, you just don't understand anything about being 14 year old today, mom. But the more we talk the more I feel like we're on that same page and the less we talk and the more we're connected only through tech, whether it's a text or she's on her computer and, we just don't spend that time together.

And so that very much answers my question and I think tracks back to what I expected and what I feel intuitively about tech and especially with regards to this topic of generosity.

But as you mentioned, it does facilitate a lot of great structure for the financial world and from a fitness standpoint, structure to me is something that can be extremely helpful as far as creating and continuing a positive trend. And I'll give you one quick example of that, when the pandemic hit and everything about our life shifted and my kids came home from school and I was homeschooling on top of working, which I had moved to my house to work from home as well, and my gym shut down and I had workout equipment at home, but I had no community to do it with. And I'm feeding my kids throughout the day. It's not just for a summer, but now we're talking about an extended period of time that I'm feeding my family three times a day. And because I'm also working at the same time and just trying not to go crazy myself, I'm looking for shortcuts to food. And so there's more cereal in the house than maybe there's ever been. There's sandwich, there's bread for sandwiches and Still trying to make some good choices here and there, but like I'm also coping and just trying to survive. And so all these things that were once not a part of my daily systems were back in. And I realized really quickly that I did not have as much discipline as I thought I had.

I had structure. And what I'm learning and what I have learned as part of that experience, that structure is actually invaluable. And because it frees up space to be disciplined in other new ways. 

I I was prepping my meals. I knew what I was taking with you when I left the house in the morning. I knew when I came home from, work that I was gonna make a meal that's balanced for the family. And I knew when I was gonna get my workout in because my day was set, my day was structured.

And then when all that got flipped upside down since then, and it's getting, it is taking two years really to find out what this new flow is now that I work from home and life is different. So structure. Structure is actually super helpful. And I think that's something that you, like you mentioned technology provides.

And so with this book that you wrote that, that is something that I appreciated about it because you came at technology from a positive standpoint. How do we, how do we use the pieces of technology that are helpful for personal finance and integrate those and accept them and utilize them as tools.

So that's something that I appreciated about it. 

[00:38:23] Bob: So first of all, thank you for rescuing the message of my book. I do think that technology can be a very powerful force. Your contributions to the book by the way, were amazing because your metaphor between exercise and CrossFit and training people physically versus training them financially is such a great fit for the message of the book and just in general, right about how we need to have consistent, small, good habits will help you find success over the long term.

And there's not a whole lot of excuse for certain things and certain financial transactions in our lives these days because of technology, they can help us budget more easily. They can help us pay off debt effectively. They can help us save money, invest, find the proper types of risk management products, whether it's life insurance or health insurance or auto insurance, like the, there's so many forms of technology that can help you do this.

And so my purpose for writing the book was to share a positive message about money and finances. There's a lot out there in digital media and the world today that says that money is evil. Or it says that, we spend too much time on our screens and technology. 

And a lot of the research I did does suggest that people who have a bad relationship with money end up doing bad things.

And people who have an overindulged relationship with their technology end up detracting from their quality of life with those tools. But I don't believe it has to be that way. I think it can be the complete opposite actually. I think they can facilitate and help us. 

And so the message of the book is that social media technology and the ad space of today. And when I say adspace, I mean if you ever scroll through your Instagram account, how many ads do you see or Facebook or YouTube makes? People make a lot of money on ad revenue. There's so many messages out there telling us that we're not good enough or that we need to spend money. It could certainly go the wrong way, but I don't believe it has to go that way.

And like I said I truly believe that technology can be a positive force for our financial lives. So I wrote the book to help the masses. To anyone who feels like they're a little bit overwhelmed or stressed by tech and money in their life to figure out how to bring them together for good as opposed to dreading those times when you have to balance the checkbook or when you, when or those feelings that you get after you rabbit holed on TikTok for an hour and you realize, wow, TikTok is draining my life away.

It doesn't have to be that way. And there's tips and tactics and things in the book that can help you with that. And there's also information related to each major financial planning and personal finance topic to help you address that specific area. Cuz if I'm being honest, you can't make a change all at once.

It's not 

No, 

I'm gonna read the book or I'm gonna read the Foreword or the introduction or Jess's awesome quote on, on the hardcover book. Thank you for that, Jess. It's not like you're gonna read that and immediately be changed, right? It's gonna take some time. So you may wanna address one thing at a time.

And so I hopefully, I, hopefully I covered as many things as I could in a succinct way to help people do that. And as I mentioned earlier, it's really about the relationship. I can give you all the tools in the world and every tip and trick and life hack for financial planning and personal debt management and budgeting.

But if you don't have a good relationship, a healthy gratitude, abundance driven relationship with technology and money in your life then you're bound to turn down the wrong path on occasion. 

[00:41:45] Jess: Yeah. Ah, that's so well said. That is that's the perfect parallel between this whole concept of generosity and this whole idea of tech and money, and it's, the tips, the tools, the tricks, the ideas, the ways to be more generous, the ways to use technology well, the ways to manage your money, the ways to be fit and healthy.

That's all there. The information is there. It is messy. And I do think that the one evil influence is people who are preying on the susceptible ones who are trying their best, who are trying to be generous, or who are trying to manage their money, or who are trying to understand technology.

And there is evil intent to take advantage of those people and manipulate and steal and not actually be helpful, but just make a profit off of the people who don't know what they're doing in those ways. And that clouds the information that does exist, right?

And so in all of these areas, whenever there's a light that's being shined on the source to say, Hey, here's some protection against the charlatans. Here's some information that speaks directly to your need that you can trust. And that's what this book is from a money tech relationship standpoint, cuz if I'm someone who's never used anything but a checkbook ledger to balance my checkbook, but now all of a sudden I'm being required to make that shift in the world, it can be scary. I don't know who to trust. I don't know where to go.

I don't know what to put my time and energy and resources into to learn. And your book is stepping in that moment and providing the source of truth that, that they can rely on to be able to make that next step into really this new world that everybody at one point in time is being invited into, and then now we're being forced into. And so I thank you for writing that and for making that available to folks. And I do endorse it not just on paper but also in spirit. 

[00:44:11] Bob: I thank you. I really appreciate it and I love how you worded that too. Because while I was writing the book, and I, this is full disclosure, this is behind the curtain of an author, you have this great idea, at least you think it's a great idea and you hope someone catches on and thankfully, I had a publisher who thought it was interesting. And my initial thought was, man, I got 12 plus years of experience in the financial industry. I'm just gonna brain dump all the brilliant ideas that I've come up with over the years. Come to find out that it's a very small percentage of accumulated knowledge and a large percentage of curiosity research and interviewing interesting and well-trained professional people like yourself and I, what I found is that, as we mentioned before, There's plenty of resources out there. Every topic in the book, all of the things that we talk about, insurance, investments, debt cryptocurrency generosity, retirement, all of those things, you can find information on these, you can find technical information on these topics.

But what you may not be able to find is the ability to connect the purpose and the reason behind why you put so much time into those things and helping find a way to use technology for good. 

And one of the chapters is dedicated to the education behind finance and technology. And that chapter is how do you teach your kids about it? And how do, where do you go to learn or who's, who are the trusted professionals? Because ultimately I think we can all be DIYs in some way or another in today's world because information is so readily available.

But what happens when you come to a point and you say, you know what I do want some professional help. You gotta know where to go. Who do you trust? Who do you ask? Who's got the technical chops, but also who's a good person that I can trust? So I hope I cover that. But thank you for the endorsement for the book. I hope it really does help people make those wise decision. 

[00:46:08] Jess: Yeah, you bet. And for anyone who's interested it, the name of the book is Personal Finance In a Public World, and it's available on Amazon. And is it Barnes and Noble? Yes. 

[00:46:19] Bob: Yep. Barnes and Noble, Amazon, Cobo, Ingram, spark, you name it. Audio. The hardcover just published whenever this episode comes out. And the audio, audio will be out shortly. 

[00:46:30] Jess: Sweet. I love it. And thank you so much, Bob, for being here. If someone out there is in a place in life where they just feel like so many things are being put on them or thrown their way, a curve ball here, did not expect that to come, walking around in a daze because I just don't know what life is about right now.

That the message that I get just from you and from my, from your story and just from the spirit of our conversation is lean in and trust. Just lean in and trust. You can trust your gut to give you that inspiration for the right next thing is, you can trust that the information is there through sources like this book.

It's out there. Find those places of trust, lean into them and just do that next thing that you're being prompted to do and have hope that down the road you'll have a clear understanding of why you are going through that season and or be able to share a message with the world like you are doing today that inspires many.

So thank you Bob for all that you've shared and for all that you continue to do. 

[00:47:43] Bob: Jess, thanks for having me. Love, love what you're doing with the show, inspiring people to make wise decisions and take a trustful leap, if you will. 

[00:47:51] Jess: Yeah. 

[00:47:52] Bob: So I appreciate it. 

[00:47:53] Jess: Listeners, if you've loved this episode of The Breakthrough Factor, don't forget to hit the subscribe button. And if you know someone who has had a breakthrough moment in their life or their business, or if you are the person who's had a breakthrough moment in your life, business, or other, please reach out, let me know. I'd love to have a conversation about bringing you on the podcast. And finally, I appreciate your reviews, your feedback, anything that you have to say that helps us get better on our end so that we can bring you a show that truly educates and encourages, it challenges you, and then ultimately helps you break through those moments in your life that are difficult and standing in the way of what you want. Cheers, friends, as always, go lift heavy and be kind. 

Jess Bost is a Retirement Income Certified Professional and the Vice President of Brand Partnerships at Alpha Architect. Due to industry regulations, Jess will not discuss any of Alpha Architect’s funds on this podcast. All opinions expressed by Jess and podcast guests are solely their own opinions and do not reflect the opinion of Alpha Architect or its affiliates. This podcast is for informational purposes only, and should not be relied upon as a basis for investment decisions. For more information, please visit w w w dot alpha architect dot com